Re: Caller Display Gone? -BT Privacy at Home

Scott wrote:
> On Mon, 19 Oct 2009 13:55:28 +0100, "Roger Mills"
> <watt.tyler@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
>> In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
>> Scott <spiced.porkandham@virgin.net>  wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 18 Oct 2009 16:58:02 +0100, "Roger Mills"
>>> <watt.tyler@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> OK, so what's the point of going to Virgin rather than BT if it
>>>> doesn't save you any money?
>>> Because I save on calls.
>>>
>>> You have obviously not read the earlier posts.  The line rental (where
>>> BT / Openreach has a virtual monopoly) is supposed to be a 'level
>>> playing field' to allow customers to choose the call provider.  Please
>>> keep up.
>> OK, so you need to add up the *total* cost for your phone service -
>> including line rental, calls, and bells & whistles like Caller Display -
and
>> *then* decide which supplier or combination of suppliers will give the best
>> deal for your usage pattern.
>
> I appreciate that, but that is not the point of my posting, which is
> to do with caller ID being offered to customers of one call provider
> (BT Retail) on more favourable terms that to customers of other
> providers (Virgin in my case) which seems to me to contravene the
> principles of a level playing field..

They offer it on exactly the same terms.  If, however, you buy a package
from BT Retail that includes free CLIP, then that is what you get. If
you buy a package that doesn't, then you don't get it.

>> I'm not aware of any regulation which says that all providers must charge
>> the same for line rental, in order to provide a "level playing
field". Where
>> does it say that?
>
> I am not saying all line providers.  I am saying that I thought that
> BT - because of its special position of having a virtual monopoly on
> landlines - had an obligation to allow other providers access on an
> equal footing and therefore to treat BT Retail exactly the same as
> other providers.

It does.

>> There are plenty of ways of saving on calls without having to pay the line
>> rental to anyone other than BT. I pay my line rental to BT, but make all my
>> daytime calls via a mixture of 18866 [1] and VoIP [2] - but make free
>> evening and weekend calls via BT. *And* I get get free Caller Display and BT
>> Answer 1571. You would probably be better off doing something like this.
>>
>> [1] 5p per call (to an 01/02/03 number) regardless of duration
>> [2] voip.co.uk - 1p per minute (charged by the second) with no call setup
>> fee
>
> Thanks for that, but my specfic question was whether BT are acting
> anti-competitively by treating customers of other providers
> differently to those of BT itself in relation to the provision of
> caller dsplay.

They aren't.
To be very clear, BT retail sell a line rental package to a customer
that includes a call tarrif. In that pricing set is a deal whereby you
get Caller Display for 'free' if you use the package in a particular way
or you have to pay otherwise.
BT Retail pay Openreach and Wholesale the prices determined by Ofcom to
enable them to do that.
Another communications provider can buy a menu of services from
Openreach and Wholesale (or even just Openreach, or just Wholesale, or
even neither) to offer a competing package. What they put in the package
and how they sell it, is up to them.

The only wrinkle is that, in some locations, other providers have chosen
not to compete in the local loop so only offer a service overlaid on the
BT Retail one. That is also their choice and so the options they sell on
to you are also constrained.  But they could pay Wholesale some money
and bundle CLIP in their offering but that would be strange as they
don't get revenue from delivering calls to you if you are only a CPS
customer.
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